Sle@zy a écrit :
tweeky a écrit :
( ...) With regards to the comment above about the Davies handmade guitar "NOT" being an original...It is indeed an original and i can substanciate this...
Hi Tweeky, and welcome to this French N4-addict Forum ! ;-)
Sorry for my poor English , but , we’ll try anyway to discuss this as this should be discussed !
In fact , I was “ waiting” for you !
D***** informed me that he was contacted by a N4 enthusiast from the US ! :-)
...But you seem to be rather from UK
First of all, let me tell you that …
the 9202026 is NOT a N4 Davies !
This is the same answer I gave to D***** , the guy who put this N4 for sell on eBay .
I will try to explain you why this is NOT a Davies ….
tweeky a écrit :
..
The serial No:9202026 ..indicates that 92=1992- 02=February- 026=the 26th guitar of a batch of 50 from the first 1000 odd guitars that Steven Davies made for Washburn in his Seattle-Washington workshop by a staff team of around 12 men.
Humm…. I really think you are wrong here, and
this is the key thing :
026= this just means that this is the n-th N4 made in February , taking into account
ALL the different “ finish “ N4. Stephen Davies never communicated about unspecified “ batch of 50 …”
tweeky a écrit :
I can also confirm the guitar is one of the original Davies-handmade In The USA because I have one of only 6 black N4s made by Steven Davies and the seial no of my guitar-9202017...making the 17th guitar of the batch of 50 Davies made...9 guitars infront of the N4 you said was not an original!
I know that Stephen Davies made a very limited run of Black N4 in early 1992 , but that’s totally independent from the fact that he may have done any others N4 “ Davies “ in 1992 as what you explained about the serial is , in my opinion, once again, wrong !…
tweeky a écrit :
Finally...the main reason for being able to substanciate these claims is the fact that after many emails to Washburn who could not find any evidence of my guitar in their records,other than it being an American 1992 model...I emailed Steven Davies himself,who conclude that my guitar was made(like the one you mention above)in his workshop in February 1992 and it was Steven who confirmed that it was one of his and infact an "ORIGINAL" guitar...and yes they did start making them in 1991 with the through neck locking nuts prior to mine(...)
since a long time ! Probably since 1998 ( i remember a review on a "GFTPM" US magazine of one of his last guitar made, a "
Stephen's " )....
His web-site is not really full of " interesting" informations about the N4.... :-( ...and i am not sure that the contact address email that is given is the Stephen's one ....
I will be glad if you could send me his email address as you sent It to D***** ;-)
It would be an interesting thing to have the Stephen confirmation .
I agree with you to say that the Washburn Customer service is a piece of crap ! They were unable to give me any good information about the 1994 Limited Run Korina ! That was the same thing about the Davies …..
One thing is sure :
Washburn contracted Stephen Davies, to make the first series N4’s that were made back in 90-91, because They didn’t even have a plant in the USA to make these guitars at the time . So if you have one of these and notice that they are made a “ little” differently and play a little better, now you know , they were not even made by Washburn
So , why Do I think that the N4 on eBay is not, I mean … a so called N4 “ Davies “ ?:
_ 1. The Neck is different than the N4 Davies one , especially the “ Stephen Extended Cutaway “ Junction “
_ 2. Not the same electronics covers
_ 3. The Body shape is slightly different
_ 4. No Kahler Tremolo , no Kahler Nut ( and no thru holes on the neck )
_ 5. No Gotoh mechanics (although some Davies were manufactured with “Washburn “ mechanics !)
_ 6. The very very early Davies were made of 1 Alder piece body , they became more than rare! (I’ve been told that Nuno has them almost “ all” ! )
But , believe me, I have never seen any Davies before with such an " ugly " ( personal taste ! ) 2 piece body as the N4 on eBay !…
_ 7. On the N4-Davies, the “ Stephen Extended Cutaway is identified with the label “ US and For Pats Pending ….” You know what I mean ? This is very explicit ! On the others N4 , as the agreement (“ Patent “ ) was received by Washburn, the label is as the one who could read on the eBay N4 :
” Patent Nos - ***** - ***** “ …..
The N4 actually listed on eBay is , totally similar to a Mass-Produced Washburn N4 ! Without exception !!
To sum up a little bit the things, I would say that , if the so called N4 Davies on ebay is a …real N4 Davies, well… so this is in fact a “ False-True” N4 Davies made exactly as a ….. post-91 N4 was made !
I hope to hear from you soon Tweeky
Now, for me , it's time to ....sleep !!
Cheers
Sle@zy wrote...."Humm…. I really think you are wrong here, and
this is the key thing :
026= this just means that this is the n-th N4 made in February , taking into account
ALL the different “ finish “ N4. Stephen Davies never communicated about unspecified “ batch of 50 …”
Here's an excerpt from Steve Davis email to me...as it was a personal email to myself,you will undertsand that I wouldn't post all the contents of email out of respect for Steven...but really can verify the info as correct and from indeed Steven Davis...
"Yes J*****, this is one of ours. We built it in Seattle, Washington in a
small shop of only about a dozen builders.
If I remember correctly, we only built 6 of the black ones. The serial
number tells me it was built in February 92 and was 17th in the batch (of
50). We designed the cutaway and licensed it to Washburn and built about the
first 1000 N4s for Washburn. They had hired Grover Jackson to get a US plant
up to build them (and other models)". ...........Steven Davis..
So you see Steven Davies did infact mention about a "Batch of 50"
Sle@zy wrote...."The N4 actually listed on eBay is , totally similar to a Mass-Produced Washburn N4 ! Without exception !!
To sum up a little bit the things, I would say that , if the so called N4 Davies on ebay is a …real N4 Davies, well… so this is in fact a “ False-True” N4 Davies made exactly as a ….. post-91 N4 was made !
"
Now it seems that up until D***** replied with some facts regarding his guitar and Steven Davies connection,you were quite unaware of these last models and how they came about and I must wonder if not knowing about these very models..if you've actually played one......but let me clarify something with regards to you're comment above on how our guitars were totally similar to "A Mass-Produced Washburn N4! Without exception !!"...first off...When Steven recieved the "VERY RAW" bodies and necks-he had to re-jig/profile them to a standard of his/yours previous earlier guitars...he said that he fretted and profiled the frets,machined the bodies and added all the hardware/electrics and ultimately finished the guitar to his standards...here's Steven Davies' viewpoint from Darylls email-on what you call "Totally similar to a Mass-Produced Washburn N4 ! Without exception !!"
"The fact that we finished the instrument, dressed the frets and set it up is why it plays so much better than the later models you have."
"The necks and bodies Grover built were fine, though slightly different in some respects than our own, and there is no lack of quality in the components themselves. (Grover had a well deserved reputation for quality instruments long before he went to Washburn). What sets this instrument apart from later Washburn models was the fact that it was assembled and built by myself and my small crew of trained luthiers. "
Steven Davies.
You see my friend...if the guy who created all these wonderful guitars and I do mean "ALL" can say this,then wouldn't you agree-he's so much more qualified than you or I to know what he's talking about!?
CONCLUSION: Sure the parts came to Steven Davies from Washburn/Grover Jackson and again there may some differences with selector covers on the back and as far as 2 piece Alder not being nice "Ugly" i think you said...does it really matter if it sounds good and it didn't do Fender any harm having 2/3 piece bodies...but whatever way you choose to look at it my friend,these guitars were only made for a matter of months and were ultmately constructed by one of the best makers out there...I can see were the purist would see things slightly different but the fact is that our guitars would have been finished to the same high standards(i'm sure Mr Davies wouldn't put his reputation on the line against something you feel is quite inferior) as the earlier ones regardles of some hardware differences...and from my own personal point of view...to know that I own one of only 6 Black N4s in the world from that period "The Davies Period"!...makes me feel pretty good..
Take it easy
Tweeky.
